The Bus Stop Farce

[Martin Weidmann]

Brutal stupidity.  Did multiple witnesses confirm that I was in Miami yesterday?  Was I arrested a short distance from the scene of a shooting in Miami with the same two brands of ammo used in the murder?  Good grief.  You should be ashamed to peddle this nonsense. I hope you are just playing devil's advocate to pass the time and don't actually believe any of your own nonsense.  There is zero doubt that Oswald murdered Tippit.  Zero.  The evidence confirms it beyond doubt.  Markham was there at the time.  She saw him do it.  Thus, we don't have to untangle your bizarre obsession with pedantic bus schedules and baseless assertions as to where people and buses should have been in a perfect world if they slavishly adhered to a schedule down to a precise minute every single day of their lives etc.  Do you think Markham and her bus relived the same day over and over again without any minor variance in time?  Like the movie Groundhog Day.  Absurd.

Brutal stupidity.

The stupidity is all yours.

Did multiple witnesses confirm that I was in Miami yesterday?

Of course, because they saw you there beating your wife. So, by your own "logic" you were there, right?

Was I arrested a short distance from the scene of a shooting in Miami with the same two brands of ammo used in the murder?

Was there a murder in Miami? How do you know.... Oh yeah, that's right.... You were there, weren't you?

You should be ashamed to peddle this nonsense.

Oh the irony... I am not peddling nonsense. I am proving that your previous comment;

Because Oswald was there as confirmed by multiple witnesses and the evidence.  If a thing happens, the odds against it happening are no longer relevant in proving that it didn't happen.

is complete BS....

The mere fact that you are now trying defend yourself against the allegation that you were in Miami, beating your wife, shows that even you accept that you can not always rely on witnesses to establish with any kind of certainty if a person was indeed where the witnesses said he was. But that might be a little over your head.....

There is zero doubt that Oswald murdered Tippit.  Zero.

I do hope that you don't actually believe any of your own nonsense.

The evidence confirms it beyond doubt.  Markham was there at the time.  She saw him do it.

Markham saw Tippit being killed, that's true.... But was Oswald the killer? The timeline suggests he could not have been.

Thus, we don't have to untangle your bizarre obsession with pedantic bus schedules and baseless assertions as to where people and buses should have been in a perfect world if they slavishly adhered to a schedule down to a precise minute every single day of their lives etc.

Of course we have to examine the discrepancy that you are so eager to overlook. If Tippit was shot at 1.14 or 1.15 Markham couldn't have been there to see it, because at that same moment she would be on Jefferson getting on her daily bus to work. People are creatures of habit.... If you take the same bus everyday, you make sure you are at the bus stop on time. There is no plausible way that Markham, who said she left home "a little after one" and only had two blocks to walk would still be at 10th Street at 1.14 and thus miss her regular bus.

Do you think Markham and her bus relived the same day over and over again without any minor variance in time?

Of course there would be minor variances in time. That's why I said that the FBI found that the bus was scheduled to stop on Jefferson at 1.12 and 1.22. Markham would have been aware of this, which is just one more reason why she would have made sure to get to the bus stop on Jefferson on time. This of course would make it even less unlikely that she would be at 10th Street to see the murder at 1.14. or 1.15. Or do you think she was in the habit of missing her regular bus every day?

[Charles Collins]

Of course she was at 10th Street at the time of the shooting, genius. But that wasn't the point, which apparently went straight over your head.

The point I was making is that Markham said she took the same bus to work everyday. She estimated the departure time from Jefferson to be 1.15, but according to the FBI the schedule for Markham's bus had stops at 1.12 and 1.22. So, if the shooting occurred at 1.14 or 1.15, then Markham couldn't have been at 10th Street, because at that time she would be getting on her regular bus on Jefferson. In other words, the shooting took place earlier than 1.14. In fact, there is sufficient circumstantial evidence to argue that the shooting probably took place between 1.06 and 1.10. This, in turn means that Oswald couldn't have been there, as he was seen at the roominghouse on Beckley at 1pm and taking the fastest route it took at least 11 minutes to get to 10th street from there.

Eyewitnesses can be and often are wrong. These witnesses were never subjected to cross-examination by a defense lawyer, which is very often the moment in court where they recant or change their story. Witness identification is the least reliable evidence there is. I know from first hand experience how difficult it is to identify a person. I once witnessed a street robbery and although I saw the robber pretty well, when the police asked me if I would be able to identify him I said no.

Having said that, if Oswald couldn't physically have been at 10th Street when Tippit was shot then the witnesses were wrong. It's as simple as that.

Wrong. You don't dismiss a clear time indication simply because it doesn't fit the narrative. Even less so when there is more circumstantial evidence to actually show that the shooting took place earlier than 1.14 or 1.15 and there is no evidence whatsoever that Tippit was really killed at 1.14 or 1.15.

Wrong again. I am not about to accept Oswald's guilt simply because you and your ilk say he is guilty. If you want to convince me of anything, you need to provide evidence that is sufficiently conclusive and holds up under scrutiny.

You are just dismissing evidence you don't like because of your predetermined conclusion that Oswald was guilty, when in fact the case against him has more holes in it than Swiss cheese. That's why LNs never want to examine or discuss the evidence honestly and complain about those who do!

Pathetic... but since I know who it is coming from, I don't give a damn.

The point I was making is that Markham said she took the same bus to work everyday. She estimated the departure time from Jefferson to be 1.15, but according to the FBI the schedule for Markham's bus had stops at 1.12 and 1.22.

And this brings us to the other bus stop farce. You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day because the 1.22 bus would have been after 1.15. However, to Markham, either bus could have been taken and she would still likely describe it as the “same bus” because they both depart Jefferson around 1.15 and take her to where she needed to go. She might or might not even be aware of the difference. It would depend on whether or not she noticed details like bus numbers, drivers, etc. And, as far as I know, she really doesn’t indicate that she did.

[Richard Smith]

The point I was making is that Markham said she took the same bus to work everyday. She estimated the departure time from Jefferson to be 1.15, but according to the FBI the schedule for Markham's bus had stops at 1.12 and 1.22.

And this brings us to the other bus stop farce. You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day because the 1.22 bus would have been after 1.15. However, to Markham, either bus could have been taken and she would still likely describe it as the “same bus” because they both depart Jefferson around 1.15 and take her to where she needed to go. She might or might not even be aware of the difference. It would depend on whether or not she noticed details like bus numbers, drivers, etc. And, as far as I know, she really doesn’t indicate that she did.

The application of common sense and reason is lost on Martin.  It is almost unfair.  Like beating a dumb animal with a stick.

[Martin Weidmann]

The point I was making is that Markham said she took the same bus to work everyday. She estimated the departure time from Jefferson to be 1.15, but according to the FBI the schedule for Markham's bus had stops at 1.12 and 1.22.

And this brings us to the other bus stop farce. You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day because the 1.22 bus would have been after 1.15. However, to Markham, either bus could have been taken and she would still likely describe it as the “same bus” because they both depart Jefferson around 1.15 and take her to where she needed to go. She might or might not even be aware of the difference. It would depend on whether or not she noticed details like bus numbers, drivers, etc. And, as far as I know, she really doesn’t indicate that she did.

Once again to try to twist my words to create a strawman.

You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day because the 1.22 bus would have been after 1.15.

I never said or assumed anything of the sort. Even if she did in fact take the 1.22 bus, she would - by her own account - be at the bus stop at 1.15 to catch her bus, whether that was a delayed 1.12 or the 1.22 bus

However, to Markham, either bus could have been taken and she would still likely describe it as the “same bus” because they both depart Jefferson around 1.15 and take her to where she needed to go. She might or might not even be aware of the difference.

True... and none of it explains why Markham would still be at 10th Street at 1.14 or 1.15 to see Tippit get killed, when she said herself she took her regular bus on Jefferson at 1.15.

It would depend on whether or not she noticed details like bus numbers, drivers, etc. And, as far as I know, she really doesn’t indicate that she did.

Irrelevant. It doesn't matter if it was actually the same bus every day. I would argue it probably wasn't. This is about the time that Markham said she took the bus on Jefferson. She estimated that time to be at 1.15. The bus schedule shows busses stopping at 1.12 and 1.22 and she could have taken either one. What she couldn't have done is be at 10th Street at 1.14 or 1.15, which means that the shooting of Tippit happened earlier.

There is enough circumstantial evidence to justify the conclusion that Tippit was really killed between 1.06 and 1.10.

[Walt Cakebread]

The point I was making is that Markham said she took the same bus to work everyday. She estimated the departure time from Jefferson to be 1.15, but according to the FBI the schedule for Markham's bus had stops at 1.12 and 1.22.

And this brings us to the other bus stop farce. You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day because the 1.22 bus would have been after 1.15. However, to Markham, either bus could have been taken and she would still likely describe it as the “same bus” because they both depart Jefferson around 1.15 and take her to where she needed to go. She might or might not even be aware of the difference. It would depend on whether or not she noticed details like bus numbers, drivers, etc. And, as far as I know, she really doesn’t indicate that she did.

And this brings us to the other bus stop farce. You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day

Markham said she caught the earlier bus because that bus would get her to work on time..... The later bus took a different route when it crossed the viaduct into downtown Dallas, and she would be late for work if she took the later bus.....

[Martin Weidmann]

The application of common sense and reason is lost on Martin.  It is almost unfair.  Like beating a dumb animal with a stick.

As John always says; an appeal to "common sense" is usually made when no evidence is available.

[Martin Weidmann]

And this brings us to the other bus stop farce. You apparently assume that she had to catch the 1.12 bus every day

Markham said she caught the earlier bus because that bus would get her to work on time..... The later bus took a different route when it crossed the viaduct into downtown Dallas, and she would be late for work if she took the later bus.....

Interesting. I have not seen that... Can you point me to where I can find this information, Walt?