The Nix Illusion

[Dan O'meara]

Mr O: can you provide the frame in Zapruder where Jackie is at the greatest distance from the rear seat/JFK, and farthest out on the trunk?
Thx.
( I have my own answer, already, but will withhold at the moment.)

My guess, just from eyeballing it, would be about z380.
By the way John, aren't you happy I've sorted out your confusion for you. It was kind of on your suggestion I looked into this.
You must be so happy I've cleared things up for you. 

[John Tonkovich]

My guess, just from eyeballing it, would be about z380.
By the way John, aren't you happy I've sorted out your confusion for you. It was kind of on your suggestion I looked into this.
You must be so happy I've cleared things up for you. 

At Z380 - your choice - Jackie's hand is about 18" to 2' away from the continental kit on the rear bumper, sprawled in the middle of the trunk. Clint, obviously, is at the left rear bumper, behind and to his left of her. Her head, and Clint Hill's head are about 2' to 3' apart. Now Zapruder is also not, at this point, perpendicular to the limo. Your alleged optical illusion in Nix should then work, in reverse, with Jackie, in the foreground, overlapping Clint Hill, in the background. This effect is not visible in Z380, or any other frames.

[Joe Elliott]

At Z380 - your choice - Jackie's hand is about 18" to 2' away from the continental kit on the rear bumper, sprawled in the middle of the trunk. Clint, obviously, is at the left rear bumper, behind and to his left of her. Her head, and Clint Hill's head are about 2' to 3' apart. Now Zapruder is also not, at this point, perpendicular to the limo. Your alleged optical illusion in Nix should then work, in reverse, with Jackie, in the foreground, overlapping Clint Hill, in the background. This effect is not visible in Z380, or any other frames.

No. Seen from behind and from the left (Nix view), they seem to overlap. Seen from behind and from the right (Zapruder view) we see the true separation.

Try looking at a couple of salt shakers, which represent the heads, a few inches apart and at a 45-degree angle between them. The one on the left, closer to you by about 3 inches. From the left and behind, they almost overlap. From the right and behind, they are widely separated.


By the way, I place it at z-375:



At z-375, Clint Hill is just the perfect distance from the standing man that is directly above him. Not z-374. Not z-376. It’s z-375.

[Chris Bristow]

I agree Jackie's difference positions between the Z and nix films are just due to the different angles it is viewed from. I mapped it out once and it accounts for the total difference in her position.. Of course if Nix had been looking down on the trunk as much as Z was the illusion would be broken. Nix would have seen Jackie's real position was farther back on the trunk.
But there are a few things I disagree with in the diagram. first the area below Jackie's armpit marked "Burnt off due to ambient light" I think is incorrect. Jackie's shadow falls to her left and it is not in the area below her armpit. There is nothing that would cast a shadow there .Turn up the saturation and it looks like blue sky reflected there.
 If you calculate the slope angle from Z to the trunk(13 degrees) then subtract 5 degrees because the curved trunk slopes away on it's far side, then continue that angle Southward( the slope raises up at 1 foot per every 2.8 feet of travel), it is pointing to the sky about just above the West end of the Annex and the trees just West of it. Continuing with the slope angle calculation the brown area at the far side of the trunk is part of the face of the annex in shadow and the trees West of it.
  The ambient light bouncing off Jackie's left side is reflected in the trunk and it is the ambient light that is cancelling out most of Jackie's body shadow.

[John Tonkovich]

No. Seen from behind and from the left (Nix view), they seem to overlap. Seen from behind and from the right (Zapruder view) we see the true separation.

Try looking at a couple of salt shakers, which represent the heads, a few inches apart and at a 45-degree angle between them. The one on the left, closer to you by about 3 inches. From the left and behind, they almost overlap. From the right and behind, they are widely separated.


By the way, I place it at z-375:



At z-375, Clint Hill is just the perfect distance from the standing man that is directly above him. Not z-374. Not z-376. It’s z-375.

May I inquire as to why it's the "perfect distance"?

[Joe Elliott]

May I inquire as to why it's the "perfect distance"?

Compare z-375 with the Zapruder frame from the first post. The Zapruder frame from that one was z-375. The frame from the Nix film looks like it was from the time frame of z-380, because the trailing foot is well off the ground.

In any case, comparing z-375 or z-380 with the frame from the Nix film tells the same story. There is clear separation between Hill and Jackie as seen from that angle.

[John Tonkovich]

Compare z-375 with the Zapruder frame from the first post. The Zapruder frame from that one was z-375. The frame from the Nix film looks like it was from the time frame of z-380, because the trailing foot is well off the ground.

In any case, comparing z-375 or z-380 with the frame from the Nix film tells the same story. There is clear separation between Hill and Jackie as seen from that angle.

Once you acknowledge the importance of the actual limo speed, and consider that Nix was closer to perpendicular to the limo than Zapruder at that point, and that Jackie's arm is touching or above the Continental spare tire housing on the back bumper - not an illusion - well...