Power cut important clarification required

[John Mytton]

Not sure I'm following you.  Are you assuming that "ambient light" means sunlight?

Ok you are working on a high floor and you finish up and it's dark outside, you turn off the lights on your floor and then what, you stumble down the stairs?
And on top of that you need to rely on everyone on the floors below to equally leave on their lights and just pray that nobody closed one of the stairwell doors which as I've shown in film and photo can be closed.



JohnM

[John Iacoletti]

Ok you are working on a high floor and you finish up and it's dark outside, you turn off the lights on your floor and then what, you stumble down the stairs?
And on top of that you need to rely on everyone on the floors below to equally leave on their lights and just pray that nobody closed one of the stairwell doors which as I've shown in film and photo can be closed.

Gotcha.  Those are reasonable questions.  I don't know enough about the TSBD building work schedules (or even how the lighting on the various floors was controlled) to know if this would be an issue or not.  That doesn't have a whole lot to do with the issue of whether Baker and Truly would have had a problem seeing where they were going in the stairway during the day if the power had been out during that time.

[John Mytton]

Gotcha.  Those are reasonable questions.  I don't know enough about the TSBD building work schedules (or even how the lighting on the various floors was controlled) to know if this would be an issue or not.  That doesn't have a whole lot to do with the issue of whether Baker and Truly would have had a problem seeing where they were going in the stairway during the day if the power had been out during that time.

The  warehouse staff worked till at least 4:45 and in winter on a dark overcast day I wouldn't want to be relying on any outside lighting.

Mr. BELIN. What were his hours of work to be?
Mr. TRULY. His hours were from 8 in the morning until 4:45 in the afternoon. His lunch period was from 12 to 12:45.

As for the light switch I don't know what this controlled but it appears to be a light switch and its location is close to where you enter this floor.



As for the stairwells being fully enclosed, I don't think they are.

In this clip from Ruby & Oswald which was filmed in the actual TSBD it suddenly dawned on me that there is no door leading up to the 2nd floor, and blah blah blah I know it's a decade later and according to you probably irrelevant, but nonetheless let's see where this goes.



The 6th floor stairwell leading down appears to have no door.



From these angles photographed not long after we see the 2nd floor stairwell going down also appears to have no door and what is also visible is a different type of light fixture that presumably lights up the sign and the stairs leading down to the first landing.







JohnM

[John Iacoletti]

The  warehouse staff worked till at least 4:45 and in winter on a dark overcast day I wouldn't want to be relying on any outside lighting.

Don't know about Australia, but in Texas it doesn't get dark in the winter by 4:45 PM.

As for the light switch I don't know what this controlled but it appears to be a light switch and its location is close to where you enter this floor.

Could be, but it could also control the overhead lights on the floor.

As for the stairwells being fully enclosed, I don't think they are.

I agree.

In this clip from Ruby & Oswald which was filmed in the actual TSBD

Not that I don't believe you, but do you have a source for Ruby & Oswald being filmed in the actual TSBD?

From these angles photographed not long after we see the 2nd floor stairwell going down also appears to have no door and what is also visible is a different type of light fixture that presumably lights up the sign and the stairs leading down to the first landing.

That makes sense.  Lights on the floors near the stairways illuminating the stairways.

[John Mytton]

Don't know about Australia, but in Texas it doesn't get dark in the winter by 4:45 PM.

Could be, but it could also control the overhead lights on the floor.

I agree.

Not that I don't believe you, but do you have a source for Ruby & Oswald being filmed in the actual TSBD?



That makes sense.  Lights on the floors near the stairways illuminating the stairways.

Don't know about Australia, but in Texas it doesn't get dark in the winter by 4:45 PM.

I didn't mean "a dark overcast day" to mean night, the sun doesn't go down at 4:45 in Australia either but at that time in the winter on a cloudy overcast day it's get dark. I just had a quick check and on the earliest sunset time you are about half an hour behind which under those conditions described above is insignificant.

Could be, but it could also control the overhead lights on the floor.

That's what I meant. But thinking about it, at night when you switch off this light then what do you do, there must be some sort of soft lighting at the elevator or stairs?

Not that I don't believe you, but do you have a source for Ruby & Oswald being filmed in the actual TSBD?

The only source for filming location I could find was on IMBD "Filming Locations: Dallas, Texas, USA"
Btw did you see my comparisons a page or two back that is pretty definitive, finding locations with that level of accuracy very rarely if ever happens. Other locations like the Texas theater and the Paines and Fraziers houses are very obviously different but the Depository and the Rooming house are filmed on location.

Anyway here's some more frameshots of the back of the building and the 6th floor.





And this gif should put any guessing to bed, through the sniper's nest window in the TVmovie we see the same 3 buildings beyond that actually exist there.

That makes sense.  Lights on the floors near the stairways illuminating the stairways.

Yes, but I still reckon that they needed a light halfway down the stairs to illuminate the bottom section that leads to a possible closed door.



JohnM

[Royell Storing]

OSHA did Not come into being until 1970.  Just look at the interior photos of the TSBD. That place is a fire trap on top of being a rat trap. Right across Elm St you also have the Dal Tex Bld = Zapruder's Sweat Shop. Lighting in the stairwells was obviously Not a major concern if a concern at all. Welcome to The South/1963.

[Richard Smith]

You're making several unfounded assumptions:

- That the Hertz sign was powered by electricity and not batteries (perhaps misunderstanding what "electronic" means)
- If powered by electricity that the Hertz sign power was metered to the TSBD building
- If powered by electricity and metered to the TSBD building that the Hertz sign was on the same electrical circuit as one or more of the elevators

In fact, your observation that the Hertz clock display was illuminated at 12:30 tells you exactly nothing about whether there was a power outage to the elevators when Mooney and Adams both observed them.

My contribution to this discussion is exposing once again how you use unfounded assumptions and insults to make your case.  Every single time.

What a basket load of gibberish.  You provide no evidence whatsoever on the topic.  And just take the usual contrarian position demanding impossible standards of proof from others.  You are suggesting we would need to verify the sign atop the TSBD was "metered" to the TSBD?  That doesn't even make any sense.  And why would anyone need to connect the sign to the elevator? We know that Baker and Truly took the freight elevator with no problem.  We aren't just discussing the elevators.  What the functional sign could show is that the power was not off in the building as some CTers have falsely interpreted the Hine testimony.  They suggest the lights were out (i.e. the power).  The facts are that the clock was functional as of 12:30.  The "electronic" sign was turned off in 1973 to conserve power.  Would you turn off a battery powered sign to conserve electricity?  I'm not saying it is conclusive but you have contributed absolutely nothing but lazy contrarian objections.  If you have proof of the power source, then share it.  If Gary Mack were still around, I would be glad to ask him since the 6th floor museum still has the sign, but that train has left the station.  Forget the sign and there are still numerous examples of the power and elevators being operational in this time frame.