Those Front Steps

[Alan Ford]

Who said that Calvery went up the steps at all? And if this person it white returned to the steps with her, why did nobody who mentioned Calvery make a mention of her as well?

Because------------presumably-------------Ms Calvery was the one who did the talking!

[Alan Ford]

Didn’t she have to remember what Calvery looked like in order to identify her?

From the back?

You mean the older black and white school photo?

Wedding photo, tire company photo!

[Alan Ford]

Photographs, other identifications.

E.g.?

[Nicholas Turner]

E.g.?

Well, firstly, as I said, I have no reason to doubt her identification, rather than saying I identify them. To identify them from the rear view images is difficult I would say. Images of Karen Westbrook and Gloria/Calvary Little bear enough of a resemblance to two of the women shown in the three women crying image for me to think this image can be used to discredit her identification, if that is what is being done. These images are of course featured on her and various places on the web.

Open to be convinced otherwise of course.

[Thomas Graves]

Okay, having read the thread on the education website and having looked at other information, I see no reason to doubt Karen Westbrook Scranton's identifications made in her oral history interview.

Oh Nicholas.

I thought you were a lot smarter than that.

Let me ask you just one question:

Self-described American Indian Stella Mae Jacob and her two colleagues Gloria Holt and Sharon Simmons said in their identically-worded FBI statements a few months after the assassination that they had watched the motorcade, together, about 150 feet down Elm Street (or about halfway between the TSBD and The Triple Underpass  -- going from memory here) on THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE STREET.

If so, shouldn't we see them standing together ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF ELM STREET in the various photo coverages of that area during the assassination?

Answer: "Yes, we should."

Question: "Well, do we?"

Answer: "No, we don't."

Question:  "Well, where do you suppose they are, then"?

Answer:  "On the other side of Elm Street?"

My comment:  "Atta boy, there's hope for you yet!"

LOL

Maybe.

-- MWT 

[Nicholas Turner]

Oh Nicholas.

I thought you were a lot smarter than that.

Let me ask you just one question:

Self-described American Indian Stella Mae Jacob and her two colleagues Gloria Holt and Sharon Simmons said in their identically-worded FBI statements a few months after the assassination that they had watched the motorcade, together, about 150 feet down Elm Street (or about halfway between the TSBD and The Triple Underpass  -- going from memory here) on THE SOUTH SIDE OF THE STREET.

If so, shouldn't we see them standing together ON THE SOUTH SIDE OF ELM STREET in the various photo coverages of that area during the assassination?

Answer: "Yes, we should."

Question: "Well, do we?"

Answer: "No, we don't."

Question:  "Well, where do you suppose they are, then"?

Answer:  "On the other side of Elm Street?"

My comment:  "Atta boy, there's hope for you yet!"

LOL

Maybe.

-- MWT 

Okay, so no, can't find someone who would match Stella Mae Jacob elsewhere. Also have seen an image identified as Sharon Simmonds that matches the woman in the headscarf in the crying women photograph. Right ...... maybe Karen Westbrook was wrong. As has been said identifying people from the rear isn't easy. Also, listening to the oral history again, she says she knows that that is because of the head scarf. Hmmmm. I'll sleep on it 

[Thomas Graves]

Okay, so no, can't find someone who would match Stella Mae Jacob elsewhere. Also have seen an image identified as Sharon Simmonds that matches the woman in the headscarf in the crying women photograph. Right ...... maybe Karen Westbrook was wrong. As has been said identifying people from the rear isn't easy. Also, listening to the oral history again, she says she knows that that is because of the head scarf. Hmmmm. I'll sleep on it 

Nicholas,

I have all the confidence in the world in you.  LOL

Just bear these things in mind. There were only two ostensibly plausible reasons for Westbrook's saying the gal to her immediate left in Zapruder was Gloria Calvery:1) the fact that that gal (Gloria Jeanne Holt) happened to have strawberry-blond hair that, in the late November sunshine, unfortunately shone a little more reddish than it actually was (especially in the color-saturated Zapruder film -- which general color-saturation was pointed out to me by my nemesis John Iacoletti), and 2) because Westbrook remembered that she, herself, had been wearing a (light blue, evidently) headscarf.

Period.  Full stop. That's it.

1) In late-November sunlight

2) In color-saturated film

3) Shot from behind them (i.e., not catching their faces except for the profile of the American Indian gal on the left way back around frame 60)

4) Shot from pretty far away

5) Shot from about a 30-degree angle above them (I'm guessing here)

6) Shot some fifty years earlier

LOL

Really?

It's interesting that smilin' and noddin' Stephen Fagin didn't ask her about the location of the other member of their quartet -- uhh ... maybe Carol Reed, or ... uhh ... maybe Karan Hicks (take your pick), don't you think?

And lastly, getting back to the gal to the left of Westbrook's "Gloria Calvery" -- isn't it interesting that in Zframe-60, etc, the skin on the side of her face is considerably darker than that on the neck of the hat-wearing man to her left, just as we would expect if she was a Native American, as Stella Mae Jacob described herself to the FBI?

Sleep well, my friend.

https://www.assassinationresearch.com/zfilm/

--  MWT