The "Domino Room Alibi"

[Colin Crow]

Mr. NORMAN. Well, we stayed there I believe until we got the news that the motorcade was coming down, let's see, is that Commerce, no Main, because Commerce- we went beck in the building, James Jarman and I.
Mr. BALL. Where did you go when you went in the building?
Mr. NORMAN. We got the east elevator. No; the west.
Mr. BALL. The west elevator?
Mr. NORMAN. The west elevator. And went to the fifth floor.
Mr. BALL. The west elevator is the one you use the push button on?
Mr. NORMAN. Yes; the one you pull the gate.
Mr. BALL. That is right. It is a push button elevator.
Mr. NORMAN. Yes.
Mr. BALL. And you went up to the fifth floor?
Mr. NORMAN. Fifth floor.

Exactly Walt, the motorcade reached Main about 12.22pm. I wonder if Norman heard this over the same radio that Rowland mentioned. Remember that initially  Jarman and Norman crossed Houston with Givens and turned back. Perhaps they were close enough to hear on that radio.

[Walt Cakebread]

Exactly Walt, the motorcade reached Main about 12.22pm. I wonder if Norman heard this over the same radio that Rowland mentioned. Remember that initially  Jarman and Norman crossed Houston with Givens and turned back. Perhaps they were close enough to hear on that radio.

There are photos that show a motorcycle parked near the front of the TSBD.....I assume that was the source of the radio transmission that Jarman heard.

There's no doubt that Jarman and Norman passed through the first floor shipping room at about 12:26....And Lee Oswald saw them.....  He could not have known that they walked through the shipping room if he had not been in the area.

Lee's casual mention of seeing "Junior" and another short Negro passing through the area was never intended to be an alibi. ( He was unaware that he needed an alibi)    At the time Lee when Lee was relating his whereabouts at the time the President passed the building he had no idea that he needed an alibi for that period.  He was simply telling the interrogators where he was, and what he was doing when the President passed by......and he recalled seeing "Junior" and another short Negro pas through the area.     

[Colin Crow]

There are photos that show a motorcycle parked near the front of the TSBD.....I assume that was the source of the radio transmission that Jarman heard.

There's no doubt that Jarman and Norman passed through the first floor shipping room at about 12:26....And Lee Oswald saw them.....  He could not have known that they walked through the shipping room if he had not been in the area.

Lee's casual mention of seeing "Junior" and another short Negro passing through the area was never intended to be an alibi. ( He was unaware that he needed an alibi)    At the time Lee when Lee was relating his whereabouts at the time the President passed the building he had no idea that he needed an alibi for that period.  He was simply telling the interrogators where he was, and what he was doing when the President passed by......and he recalled seeing "Junior" and another short Negro pas through the area.   

Looking at the floor plan of the first floor I think it’s more likely he saw them pass by the window than walking in the building. They initially went to the east elevator......the line of sight from the domino room door makes it difficult unless he was sitting on the southern bench seat.

[Walt Cakebread]

Looking at the floor plan of the first floor I think it’s more likely he saw them pass by the window than walking in the building. They initially went to the east elevator......the line of sight from the domino room door makes it difficult unless he was sitting on the southern bench seat.

Since the Domino Room was in the North east corner of the first floor with windows on the east and north sides of the room Lee could easily have seen Jarman and Norman walk by and then heard them enter and walk to the west elevator.....I certainly don't know where they were when he saw them, but there's no doubt that he did see them.   He may have deduced that they entered the back door simply by seeing them walk by the windows and then heard the elevator as they climbed aboard .

I don't believe the details are important....   The FACT is;  Lee was NOT on the sixth floor just a couple of minutes before the shots were fired....And it's not rational or logical to think that if he was preparing to shoot the Pres, that he'd be five floors beneath the alleged "Sniper's Nest" ....particularly when the parade was scheduled to be at Houston and Elm at 12:20....and at the Trade mart at 12:30....

The LNer's believe that Lee plotted and planned to murder JFK.....  I'd hasten tp point out that if he had plotted the murder he wouldn't have been sitting in the Domino Room at the very moment the parade was scheduled to pass by the building.

[Alan Hardaker]

It is completely utterly ridiculous  to suggest a fit and active 24 year old couldn't get from the 6th floor to the second floor in 90 seconds or so.

Who is actually suggesting this?

He would be in with a chance of getting from the 6th floor to the second floor and back up to the SN in 90 seconds.Now that would be a close run but...from the 6th to the 2nd in 90 secs...

So, what's your point? That he could have made it?.... Really?

Perhaps you should consider this;

The wooden stairs of the TSBD were old and noisy. Running down the stairs normally goes faster than going up, but going down at a higher rate of speed would likely produce more sound, wouldn't it? So, how come nobody on the 5th, 4th or 3rd floor heard or saw anything post shots? Especially, Dorothy Garner, who according to the Stroud letter, said that after Victoria Adams and Sandra Styles had gone down the stairs, she saw Baker and Truly come up. Are we really to believe that Oswald, running down the stairs, would not have been noticed by either Adams, Styles or Garner?

Again this argument carries very little credence. Yes going down the stirwell would make some noise, but if a person was trying to avoid detection they are hardly likely to come down fe-fi-foing now are they...and there's also the fact that the commotion and noise coming from the throngs of people out on the street would've drowned out any noise coming from the stirwell...and please remember the action was outside so the people on floors 3/4/5 would've obviously be looking out of the building to try and see what actually happened. By the time Baker & Truly hit the stirwell,the person decending, given the timeline, could've easily been on the second floor. And you make it sound as if it is impossible for the person decending to avoid being seen.

Nothing in this thread or in any other thread gives any real reason why a fit and active person could not decend from the 6th to the 2nd, in the time frame, without being seen or heard.Nothing. Whether that person was Oswald or whether Oswald was the shooter, is another matter.I believe he was the shooter.Others may differ.

[Anthony Clayden]

Walt,

The majority LN view is that he was not downstairs at that time and the naming of 2 people who just happened to walk through that area just prior to the shooting was either luck or him hearing them on the 5th whilst he was on the 6th.

[Walt Cakebread]

Walt,

The majority LN view is that he was not downstairs at that time and the naming of 2 people who just happened to walk through that area just prior to the shooting was either luck or him hearing them on the 5th whilst he was on the 6th.

the naming of 2 people who just happened to walk through that area just prior to the shooting was either luck or him hearing them on the 5th whilst he was on the 6th.

the naming of 2 people who just happened to walk through that area just prior to the shooting was luck....  Luck??  Could Lee have simply made a lucky guess that "Junior" (Jarman) and his companion a little short Negro ( Norman) had walked past the Domino room at 12:26??

The odds are astronomical....  And if he hadn't seen them do you believe he would have made such a WAG and told the interrogators that he had seen them as they traveled from the front of the TSBD to the west elevator??  Lee wasn't stupid .....He would have known that the cops would likely verify every word he uttered.


or him hearing them on the 5th whilst he was on the 6th.

Lee didn't know either Jarman or Norman....He recognized that they were employees when he saw them walk by but he didn't know them....So how the hell would he identify them by the sound of their voices through the floor of the sixth floor if he had been there??