Assassination Witnesses Never Called to give Testimony at the Warren Commission

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Offline Jerry Freeman

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It most certainly is smoke.  It does not matter what you think it matters what these 5 people saw and corroborated. It is not the end of the world, Organ, but you are blind. Now use your ears and listen to the video 5 witnesses from 4 locations
Peter...It seems that these guys would have to be waterboarded to watch any conflicting FIRST HAND testimony!
Also..it does not matter what they said they saw--only what the Report said they saw.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2020, 07:34:54 PM by Jerry Freeman »

Offline Peter Kleinschmidt

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That's three now, Thought extinct ... but with us today.

Bowers  Saw some "unusual occurrence", probably visual ("flash of light or smoke") in "that area" (the opening between the pergola and the east end of the fence, about where a black couple reportedly ran from). Bowers said he saw no one behind the fence.  Holland  Holland's line-of-sight coincides with the back of the retaining wall, where a black couple reportedly ran from, and is similar to what Bowers reported.Dodd  Same line-of-sight as Holland.  Simmons  Similar line-of-sight as Holland, but Simmons originally said he "saw exhaust fumes of smoke near the embankment in front of the Texas School Book Depository Building."  Olivier  :D

I guess we're not going to hear from Hudson and Sitzman, who were feet from the fence corner, who reported no rifle being fired so near them, saw no smoke and detected no smell of a gun having been fired.

Sitzman the liar who insisted her Ukrainian-born boss go home after he had forgot to bring his camera to work that day? Sitzman who has an answer for everything like the bottle of soda hitting the concrete? That idiot, you mean? She would not last under any serious questioning. Oh! but she also said  Sitzman stated, "I have no qualms saying that I'm almost sure that there was someone behind the fence or in that area up there [near the fence], but I'm just as sure that they had silencers because there was no sound."

Offline Jerry Freeman

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Quote
Mr. LIEBELER. An echo effect?
Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir.; and this woman came up to me and she was just in hysterics. She told me, "They are shooting the President from the bushes." So I immediately proceeded up here.
Mr. LIEBELER. You proceeded up to an area immediately behind the concrete structure here that is described by Elm Street and the street that runs immediately in front of the Texas School Book Depository, is that right?
Mr. SMITH. I was checking all the bushes and I checked all the cars in the parking lot.
Mr. LIEBELER. There is a parking lot in behind this grassy area back from Elm Street toward the railroad tracks, and you went down to the parking lot and looked around?
Mr. SMITH. Yes, sir; I checked all the cars. I looked into all the cars and checked around the bushes. Of course, I wasn't alone. There was some deputy sheriff with me, and I believe one Secret Service man when I got there.
I got to make this statement, too. I felt awfully silly, but after the shot and this woman, I pulled my pistol from my holster, and I thought, this is silly, I don't know who I am looking for, and I put it back. Just as I did, he showed me that he was a Secret Service agent.
Mr. LIEBELER. Did you accost this man?
Mr. SMITH. Well, he saw me coming with my pistol and right away he showed me who he was.
Mr. LIEBELER. Do you remember who it was?
Mr. SMITH. No, sir; I don't--
The Secret Service denied having anyone in the plaza from their agency.
        Maybe he was just grilling hamburgers back there?     :-\

Offline Peter Kleinschmidt

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Someone's nationality has relevance?

It's the critics who couldn't handle the truth. Lane and Thompson, who interviewed her, didn't like her non-confirmation of a grassy knoll shooter.

Only late in life, influenced by books and TV, did she off-handedly allow the possibility. But she was always consistent from early on about the black couple's actions and that there was no gunman behind the fence.
 
The parameters of rationalizing start when you ignored the most important part which makes Sitzman completely inconsistent. The fact that she contradicted herself means she was inconsistent. Not a big deal since LHO was never convicted.
Since we both know what she said, that would be another witness of yours who would fall short of helping your narrative. Completely useless to you, but more important another hostile witness caught playing make-believe.
Since we know Mr. Zapruder's film was altered and since we know he was a native of Ukraine which fell under the umbrella of the Soviet Union then we can say it is very fishy. LHO wasn't born there. Who would have ever thought, old man Zapruder with his perfect cover? You wouldn't suspect a haberdasher, would you? Don't be lazy, start looking at shady Abraham. Something just is not right about that guy.

Offline Gary Craig

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Online Mitch Todd

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You think Smith literally examined the ID?

Read his recollection. He's already assumed the man is with the Secret Service: "Of course, I wasn't alone. There was some deputy sheriff with me, and I believe one Secret Service man when I got there."

Then he "felt awfully silly". Then the man "showed" him he was an agent. Flashed some ID that Smith assumed was SS? Could have been a plainclothes officer.

If that's smoke in Wiegman, they were using artillery on the knoll.
Richard Dodd, one of the railroad workers on top of the triple overpass, told Mark Lane about a Katy Railroad "Special Agent" who was among the guys "checking cars" in the parking lot atop the GK after the assassination. Ever since I heard that, I've wondered if the MKT Dick was the "Agent" that Smith ran into. The MKT railroad detectives really did have badges that prominently featured "Special Agent," and I can see Smith seeing those words on an MKT badge, and not paying too much attention to the rest. There's really not much int the way of proof to the contention, but it makes more sense than most if not all of the other notions I've seen floated as to the "SS Agent's" identity.  At least Dodd can place the guy at the scene, and the lot's adjacency to the railroad yard would lead to the reasonable expectation that the MKT agent would be in the area. I guess the conspiracy theorists can run with it too; instead of a fake SS agent, the GK conspirator could have been a fake MKT detective! Woo Hoo! Just that Ofc Smith didn't pay attention to the cover and wound up inadvertently drawing attention to an encounter that otherwise would have gone unremarked upon.   

Offline Ray Mitcham

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That's three now, Thought extinct ... but with us today.

Bowers  Saw some "unusual occurrence", probably visual ("flash of light or smoke") in "that area" (the opening between the pergola and the east end of the fence, about where a black couple reportedly ran from). Bowers said he saw no one behind the fence.  Holland  Holland's line-of-sight coincides with the back of the retaining wall, where a black couple reportedly ran from, and is similar to what Bowers reported.Dodd  Same line-of-sight as Holland.  Simmons  Similar line-of-sight as Holland, but Simmons originally said he "saw exhaust fumes of smoke near the embankment in front of the Texas School Book Depository Building."  Olivier  :D

I guess we're not going to hear from Hudson and Sitzman, who were feet from the fence corner, who reported no rifle being fired so near them, saw no smoke and detected no smell of a gun having been fired.

Thompson: (resumes recording) So now I believe the motorcade has made the turn onto Houston Street and is proceeding down Houston Street. Sorry we were interrupted.
Sitzman: Try it again. There was nothing unusual until the first sound, which I thought was a firecracker, mainly because of the reaction of President Kennedy. He put his hands up to guard his face and leaned to the left, and the motorcade, you know, proceeded down the hill. And the next thing that I remembered correct ... clearly was the shot that hit him directly in front of us, or almost directly in front of us, that hit him on the side of his fa ... [sic]
Thompson: Where on the side of the head did that shot appear to hit?
Sitzman: I would say it'd be above the ear and to the front.
Thompson: In other words, if one drew a line vertically upward from the tip of the ear, it would be forward of that line?
Sitzman: Yeah.
Thompson: It would then mean the left ... back of the temple, but on the side of the head, back of the temple?
Sitzman: Between the eye and the ear.
Thompson: Between the eye and the ear.
Sitzman: And we could see his brains come out, you know, his head opening. It must have been a terrible shot because it exploded his head, more or less.
Thompson: Did you see what the President's movement was at that point? I mean, how his head moved or how his body seemed to move under the impact of the shot.
Sitzman: No, I guess ... I saw his, you know, the shot hit his head and what happened to his head, and I don't care what anybody says, I was looking at his head. I wasn't paying any attention which way he was moving or anything else, because it's something that I've never seen before, you know, and kind of ugh.
Thompson: Did you see the head flip, though, under the impact in any particular direction -- forward, backward, to the left?
Sitzman: No, I don't recall if I did or not. I just, you know, this is what I saw, this is what I remember.
Thompson: Right, right.
Sitzman: And as far as the sound of the shots go, the first one, as I said, sounded like a firecracker, and the second one that I heard sounded the same, because I recall no difference whatsoever in them. And I'm sure that if the second shot would have come from a different place -- and the supposed theory is they would have been much closer to me and on the right side -- I would have heard the sounding of the gun much closer, and I probably had a ringing in my head because the fence was quite close to where we were standing, very close. Ah, it just sounded the same way.


Emmett Hudson

Mr. HUDSON - No, sir. I'll tell you - this young fellow that was sitting there with me - standing there with me at the present time, he says, "lay down, Mister, somebody is shooting the President." He says, "Lay down, lay down." and he kept repeating, "Lay down." so he was already laying down one way on the sidewalk, so I just laid down over on the ground and resting my arm on the ground and when that third shot rung out and when I was close to the ground - you could tell the shot was coming from above and kind of behind.
Mr. LIEBELER - How could you tell that?
Mr. HUDSON - Well, just the sound of it.
Mr. LIEBELER - You heard it come from sort of behind the motorcade and then above?