A snapshot into the mind of Dr. Cyril Wecht

[Joe Elliott]

"I think the Clark Panel was off by 4 inches."

Every government inquiry since the Clark Panel announced the 4 inch higher entrance wound in JFK's skull,

including the Rockefeller Commission and the HSCA, has agreed there was a bullet hole in the cowlick area.

And every government inquiry since the Warren Commission agreed there was just one bullet that passed through the skull, not two. You just cherry pick the conclusions you like and ignore the rest.

Larry Sturdivan?s ?The JFK Myths? made a good case for the entry point being near the EOP, not the cowlick.

But what this or that government study said doesn?t matter. What would matter was if a real ballistic expert, and expert who runs real world experiments with ballistic gel, bone targets, etc. said that WCC/MC FMJ bullets can and do leave a trail of metal fragments along the bullet path.

Can you name such a ballistic expert? Does that ballistic expert show pictures and X-Rays that demonstrate this is so, maybe using a human skull or a model of a human skull as the target?

Larry Sturdivan made it clear that bullet fragments follow curved and unpredictable paths, so I would not expect the metal fragments to mark the path of the bullet. But if you know of a ballistic expert with a different opinion, please enlighten us.

[Jerry Freeman]

There was nothing 'premium' at all about that ration of hog wash

[Joe Elliott]

A conspiracy in the Kennedy assassination appeals to both the extreme right and left wing. Anyone who is against Democracy and thinks we would be better off with a Communist dictatorship or a Fascist dictatorship.

Many CTers try to steer people into thinking that parts of the U. S. Government murdered President Kennedy. To get control of the government. And this same group controls the government to this day. If one can believe this one is halfway to convincing them that a non-secret dictatorship is maybe not worse than a secret dictatorship, which democracies seemed to be prone to falling under the control of.

Because extreme right wingers are in more disrepute than left wingers, I think most extreme right wingers keep silent on this, no wishing to harm the Pro-Conspiracy arguments. The left wingers are doing a good enough job convincing people that there was a conspiracy that they don?t need any help, and any help would be counter-productive.

Both Gary Craig and Jerry Freeman seem to think my post was hogwash.

If so, can either of them name a dictator, a spokesman for a dictatorship, or anyone who believes a certain form dictatorship is the best form of government, who has said that they believe that Oswald alone killed President Kennedy?

Can they name even one?

The appeal of a conspiracy thinking to these people is obvious.

[Gary Craig]

Both Gary Craig and Jerry Freeman seem to think my post was hogwash.

If so, can either of them name a dictator, a spokesman for a dictatorship, or anyone who believes a certain form dictatorship is the best form of government, who has said that they believe that Oswald alone killed President Kennedy?

Can they name even one?

The appeal of a conspiracy thinking to these people is obvious.

 

"...Popular belief in a conspiracy was widespread within a week of Kennedy's murder. Between November 25 and 29, 1963, University of Chicago pollsters asked more than 1,000 Americans whom they thought was responsible for the president's death. By then, the chief suspect, Oswald -- a leftist who had lived for a time in Soviet Union -- had been shot dead while in police custody by Jack Ruby, a local hoodlum with organized crime connections.

While the White House, the FBI, and the Dallas Police Department all affirmed that Oswald had acted alone, 62 percent of respondents said they believed that more than one person was involved in the assassination. Only 24 percent thought Oswald had acted alone. Another poll taken in Dallas during the same week found 66 percent of respondents believing that there had been a plot. There were no JFK conspiracy theories in print at that time..."


"...many senior U.S. officials concluded that there had been a plot but rarely talked about it openly.
Kennedy's successor, Lyndon Johnson, publicly endorsed the Warren Commissions conclusion that Oswald acted alone. Privately, LBJ told many people, ranging from Atlantic contributor Leo Janos to CIA director Richard Helms, that he did not believe the lone-gunman explanation.

The president's brother Robert and widow Jacqueline also believed that he had been killed by political enemies, according to historians Aleksandr Fursenko and Tim Naftali. In their 1999 book on the Cuban missile crisis, One Hell of a Gamble: Khrushchev, Castro, and Kennedy, 1958-1964, they reported that William Walton -- a friend of the First Lady -- went to Moscow on a previously scheduled trip a week after JFK's murder. Walton carried a message from RFK and Jackie for their friend, Georgi Bolshakov, a Russian diplomat who had served as a back-channel link between the White House and the Kremlin during the October 1962 crisis: RFK and Jackie wanted the Soviet leadership to know that "despite Oswald's connections to the communist world, the Kennedys believed that the president was felled by domestic opponents."

In the Senate, Democrats Richard Russell of Georgia and Russell Long of Louisiana both rejected official accounts of the assassination. In the executive branch, Joseph Califano, the General Counsel of Army in 1963 and later Secretary of Health Education and Welfare, concluded that Kennedy had been killed by a conspiracy.* In the White House, H.R. Haldeman, chief of staff to President Richard Nixon,
wanted to reopen the JFK investigation in 1969. Nixon wasn't interested.

Suspicion persisted in the upper echelons of the U.S. national security agencies, as well. Col. L. Fletcher Prouty, chief of Pentagon special operations in 1963 (and later an adviser to Stone), believed that there had been a plot.

Winston Scott, chief of the CIA's station in Mexico City at the time of Kennedy's murder and an ultra-conservative Agency loyalist, rejected the Warren Commission's findings about a trip that Oswald had taken to Mexico six weeks before the assassination. Scott concluded in an unpublished memoir that Oswald had, indeed, been just a patsy.

None of these figures was a paranoid fantasist. To the contrary, they constituted a cross section of the American power elite in 1963. Neither did they talk about a JFK conspiracy for public consumption; they talked about it only reservedly, in confined circles..."

http://www.theatlantic.com/national/archive/2010/11/the-kennedy-assassination-47-years-later-what-do-we-really-know/66722/

[Joe Elliott]

Gary, again you dodge my question. So I will ask it again:

Both Gary Craig and Jerry Freeman seem to think my post was hogwash.

If so, can either of them name a dictator, a spokesman for a dictatorship, or anyone who believes a certain form dictatorship is the best form of government, who has said that they believe that Oswald alone killed President Kennedy?

Can they name even one?

The appeal of a conspiracy thinking to these people is obvious.

Yes, one can name people who believe in Democracy who believe in the JFK Conspiracy. One can also find such people in the past who believed in a world-wide Jewish conspiracy, or a world-wide Catholic conspiracy, or a world-wide Free Mason conspiracy. Those beliefs used to be very common throughout America in the past before they fell out of fashion.

Give me a name and site it of a dictator or a spokesman for a dictatorship who believe Oswald acted alone. So simply state that no, you can?t come up with one.

I can give the name of some who did support conspiracy, like Khrushchev and Castro. And there are probably several others I don?t know. I the rest of them have figured out that they can help the American JFK conspiracy theory if they remain silent.

[Gary Craig]

Gary, again you dodge my question. So I will ask it again:

Both Gary Craig and Jerry Freeman seem to think my post was hogwash.

If so, can either of them name a dictator, a spokesman for a dictatorship, or anyone who believes a certain form dictatorship is the best form of government, who has said that they believe that Oswald alone killed President Kennedy?

Can they name even one?

The appeal of a conspiracy thinking to these people is obvious.

Yes, one can name people who believe in Democracy who believe in the JFK Conspiracy. One can also find such people in the past who believed in a world-wide Jewish conspiracy, or a world-wide Catholic conspiracy, or a world-wide Free Mason conspiracy. Those beliefs used to be very common throughout America in the past before they fell out of fashion.

Give me a name and site it of a dictator or a spokesman for a dictatorship who believe Oswald acted alone. So simply state that no, you can?t come up with one.

I can give the name of some who did support conspiracy, like Khrushchev and Castro. And there are probably several others I don?t know. I the rest of them have figured out that they can help the American JFK conspiracy theory if they remain silent.

You should start a seperate thread. This has nothing to do with the discussion.

You can title it"Joe's Hogwash".

[Joe Elliott]

My posts have nothing to do with this thread?

Gary, what are the first few sentences of the initial post of this thread?

I have observed that over the years the majority of WC critics have come from the left of the political spectrum. IMO, their political leanings have influenced in one form or another their view of the WC conclusions. To date I'm not aware of any criticism or rejection from the right of the conclusions reached by the WC other than that offered by Roger Stone with his theory that Lyndon Johnson was responsible for the assassination.

I point out that pushing a government conspiracy appeals equally to the far right as it does to the far left.

Roger Stone is the only right winger who pushes the government conspiracy angle?

What about James Fetzer? He was a leading spokesman for the CT side for many years. I am certain there are many posters here who do, or at least who used to, think well of him. He?s a big believer in Large Secret Jewish conspiracies. He has also become a Holocaust denier. If he is not a far right CTer, who is?

Then there is Michael T. Griffith. He has been a popular ?Go-To? expert on discounting the neurological spasm explanation for JFK going backwards from the headshot, on the strength of his pulling the wool over a doctor?s eyes and not informing him of film showing what happens when a goat is shot through the brain. And getting a statement from that doctor that the neurological spasm theory seemed an unlikely explanation. Even doctors should withhold opinions until they have observed a real-life animal being shot through the brain. Well, our good Michael T. Griffith is also a fan on the Confederate States of American, as can be seen at his website below:

http://civilwar.miketgriffith.com/

with articles on ?The War of Northern Aggression? and ?The War for Southern Independence?. I think we can all agree that Michael T. Griffith is a far-right winger.

And these are just a couple from the top of my head. I?m sure with a little digging, others can be found.

The reasons why a U. S. Government Conspiracy appeals to both the far-left wingers and the far-right wingers are obvious. Neither are fans of democratic government. Anything that states that democratic government doesn?t work, like because it is subject to seizure and control by Large-Secret-Enduring Conspiracies is a notion that both are going to support.