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Author Topic: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar  (Read 29744 times)

Offline Richard Smith

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #112 on: June 10, 2022, 05:04:18 PM »
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He picked his mind (to no avail) wondering what the rifle in the rolled up blanket held together with string contained instead of simply asking Marina.


Would you clarify, please?    The bottom line in the rifle in the blanket controversy is:....  There's simply not one iota of solid physical evidence that the rifle was in that blanket in the Paine's garage.   

Not one iota?  Oswald's own wife confirmed that she saw it there.  LOL.  Not only that.  But when she heard the news of the assassination, she entered the garage to check if the blanket was still there.  Not only that.  When the police arrived on Nov. 22, Marina directed them to the blanket expecting them to find the rifle.  She was "surprised" when they didn't find it there. Was Marina in on the fantasy plot to frame Oswald even before the police arrived on Nov. 22?  You probably believe that but is laughable.

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #112 on: June 10, 2022, 05:04:18 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #113 on: June 10, 2022, 07:28:39 PM »
Not one iota?  Oswald's own wife confirmed that she saw it there.  LOL.  Not only that.  But when she heard the news of the assassination, she entered the garage to check if the blanket was still there.  Not only that.  When the police arrived on Nov. 22, Marina directed them to the blanket expecting them to find the rifle.  She was "surprised" when they didn't find it there. Was Marina in on the fantasy plot to frame Oswald even before the police arrived on Nov. 22?  You probably believe that but is laughable.

Is anything that you've cited... PHYSICAL evidence??   

Offline Richard Smith

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #114 on: June 10, 2022, 08:25:08 PM »
Is anything that you've cited... PHYSICAL evidence??   

Huh?  You said there was "not one iota" of evidence but now backtracking?  What "physical" evidence would there be that someone had kept a rifle in a blanket.  You reject the fiber evidence.  Oswald's own wife saw it with her own eyes.  Was it a mirage?  Your story is that she lied because the authorities coerced her.  But we know that she confirmed that a rifle was in the garage literally from the moment that she learned of the assassination.  Before anyone could have coerced her to confirm that fact.  She directed the police to the garage when they first asked about a rifle.

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #114 on: June 10, 2022, 08:25:08 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #115 on: June 10, 2022, 08:34:42 PM »
I don't think you can make any kind of assumption about what rifle (if any) was in Ruth Paine's garage and when, based on events that happened several months earlier and here's why;

Even if Oswald ordered the rifle and he did so for himself (instead of possibly being manipulated to do it) and even if the rifle he is holding in the BY photos is the MC rifle, all that tells you, at best, that he had a rifle in March/April 1963. Although it might seem logical to assume that the rifle in Ruth Paine's garage, in late September, would be the same rifle, it really isn't logical at all.

Oswald is alleged to have used his rifle to shoot at General Walker in April. He is then supposed to somehow have taken that rifle, a weapon that has now been used in an attempted murder, with him to New Orleans, risking possible exposure of himself with the rifle. He then is supposed to have kept the rifle with him during his entire stay in New Orleans only to turn it over to Ruth Paine, a person he barely knew, giving up total control over that rifle for several weeks and potentially causing a problem between himself and the woman with whom his wife and daughter would be staying.

It seems far more logical to me that he would have disposed of the rifle after shooting at General Walker (if that's what he did) and before his trip to New Orleans.

then isn't it very likely that the rifle that Marina Oswald said she saw in the blanket inside Ruth Paine's garage is the very same rifle that Lee Oswald ordered from Klein's seven months earlier?

Or would a more reasonable and more sensible conclusion be that the rifle Marina saw in the blanket in late September or early October* was a rifle that belonged to somebody else other than Lee Harvey Oswald?

I think it's fairly easy to figure out the most-likely-to-be-correct answer to that one.


The problem with this is that whatever you think you can figure out is nothing more than conjecture based on assumptions. It is not evidence. You can consider something to be very likely as much as you like, but that doesn't mean that it is true. The basic error you are making is that you base your assumptions on your opinion that Oswald is guilty, which is the world upside down.

The bottom line is that there is no evidence whatsoever to show that there ever was a rifle in Ruth Paine's garage, at any time, except for Marina telling us that she once saw one, about a week after her trip from New Orleans. Everything else Marina said about that rifle, that it belonged to Oswald and still was there on 11/21/63 are mere assumptions. I find it incredibly unbelievable that Marina never confronted Oswald about that rifle being there, especially because she knew that Ruth Paine didn't like guns one bit and a rifle being stored in her garage could well cause major problems between Marina and Ruth.

The bottom line is that there is no evidence whatsoever to show that there ever was a rifle in Ruth Paine's garage, at any time, except for Marina telling us that she once saw one, about a week after her trip from New Orleans.

When the FBI examined the carcano they didn't find a single blanket fiber on the rifle.   If the rifle had been transported from New Orleans in that blanket and then left on the floor of the garage there certainly would have been blanket fibers adhering to the rifle.   BUT....   There must have been "something" that resembled a rifle in that rolled up blanket.....  ( Mike Piane said that he thought  the blanket contained "camping gear".)   

Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #116 on: June 10, 2022, 09:38:30 PM »
Is anything that you've cited... PHYSICAL evidence??   

Of course it isn't. He never presents evidence of any kind. All he does is ramble on and rant.

"Richard" is easily understood and explained. He knows full well that he can not defend the official narrative because of the problematic and weak nature of the evidence. So he doesn't even try to defend it and instead does the next best thing; trying to ridicule anybody who questions the official narrative by posting one pathetic rant after another, making false claims that he can and will never back up with evidence and constantly repeating the same old debunked BS over and over again.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2022, 11:21:33 PM by Martin Weidmann »

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #116 on: June 10, 2022, 09:38:30 PM »


Offline Walt Cakebread

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #117 on: June 11, 2022, 12:56:06 AM »
Huh?  You said there was "not one iota" of evidence but now backtracking?  What "physical" evidence would there be that someone had kept a rifle in a blanket.  You reject the fiber evidence.  Oswald's own wife saw it with her own eyes.  Was it a mirage?  Your story is that she lied because the authorities coerced her.  But we know that she confirmed that a rifle was in the garage literally from the moment that she learned of the assassination.  Before anyone could have coerced her to confirm that fact.  She directed the police to the garage when they first asked about a rifle.

 You said there was "not one iota" of evidence but now backtracking?

One of us is a damned liar.....  Here's what I wrote....

There's simply not one iota of solid physical evidence that the rifle was in that blanket in the Paine's garage.   

Online Martin Weidmann

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #118 on: June 11, 2022, 01:27:21 AM »
You said there was "not one iota" of evidence but now backtracking?

One of us is a damned liar.....  Here's what I wrote....

There's simply not one iota of solid physical evidence that the rifle was in that blanket in the Paine's garage.   

That's exactly the way "Richard" operates. He ignores the parts he doesn't like (in this case the word "physical") and complete misrepresents what you have said. It is a waste of time to talk to this guy, which is exactly why I have started to ignore him.

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Re: Ruthie Paine's Confusing Calendar
« Reply #118 on: June 11, 2022, 01:27:21 AM »


Online David Von Pein

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Re: The Rifle In Ruth Paine's Garage
« Reply #119 on: June 11, 2022, 03:20:32 AM »
I don't think you can make any kind of assumption about what rifle (if any) was in Ruth Paine's garage and when, based on events that happened several months earlier and here's why;

Even if Oswald ordered the rifle and he did so for himself (instead of possibly being manipulated to do it) and even if the rifle he is holding in the BY photos is the MC rifle, all that tells you, at best, that he had a rifle in March/April 1963. Although it might seem logical to assume that the rifle in Ruth Paine's garage, in late September, would be the same rifle, it really isn't logical at all.

Oswald is alleged to have used his rifle to shoot at General Walker in April. He is then supposed to somehow have taken that rifle, a weapon that has now been used in an attempted murder, with him to New Orleans, risking possible exposure of himself with the rifle. He then is supposed to have kept the rifle with him during his entire stay in New Orleans only to turn it over to Ruth Paine, a person he barely knew, giving up total control over that rifle for several weeks and potentially causing a problem between himself and the woman with whom his wife and daughter would be staying.

It seems far more logical to me that he would have disposed of the rifle after shooting at General Walker (if that's what he did) and before his trip to New Orleans.

then isn't it very likely that the rifle that Marina Oswald said she saw in the blanket inside Ruth Paine's garage is the very same rifle that Lee Oswald ordered from Klein's seven months earlier?

Or would a more reasonable and more sensible conclusion be that the rifle Marina saw in the blanket in late September or early October* was a rifle that belonged to somebody else other than Lee Harvey Oswald?

I think it's fairly easy to figure out the most-likely-to-be-correct answer to that one.


The problem with this is that whatever you think you can figure out is nothing more than conjecture based on assumptions. It is not evidence. You can consider something to be very likely as much as you like, but that doesn't mean that it is true. The basic error you are making is that you base your assumptions on your opinion that Oswald is guilty, which is the world upside down.

The bottom line is that there is no evidence whatsoever to show that there ever was a rifle in Ruth Paine's garage, at any time, except for Marina telling us that she once saw one, about a week after her trip from New Orleans. Everything else Marina said about that rifle, that it belonged to Oswald and still was there on 11/21/63 are mere assumptions. I find it incredibly unbelievable that Marina never confronted Oswald about that rifle being there, especially because she knew that Ruth Paine didn't like guns one bit and a rifle being stored in her garage could well cause major problems between Marina and Ruth.

But, Martin, don't forget the fact that Marina—within hours of President Kennedy's assassination on 11/22/63—directed the police straight to Ruth Paine's garage and straight to that blanket on the floor. And when she did that on November 22nd she was directing the police to the place in Ruth's house where Marina was certain that her husband stored a rifle.

And regardless of what rifle it was—the C2766 Mannlicher-Carcano or another rifle altogether—Marina obviously thought that A RIFLE of some kind was wrapped up in that blanket in Ruth Paine's garage. Wouldn't you agree with that last statement?

Or do you really think that Marina concocted her "There's A Rifle In The Garage" story right on the spot on the day of the assassination itself when she led the cops straight to the blanket on 11/22? And thusly, via such a concoction, she was in essence attempting to point an accusing finger of guilt directly at Lee Oswald for the murder of the President. Or at least it would certainly appear that way at the time she did it on Nov. 22. Would you not agree?

Now, just ask yourself: Why on Earth would Marina have wanted to invent such a lie about a rifle being stored in Ruth Paine's garage just hours after Marina herself knew that the President had just been shot and killed from the very same place where her husband was employed?

The notion that Marina Oswald would have ever conceived of inventing such a false story about the rifle on the very day of the assassination is just too far-fetched to be believed.

I do, however, agree with this comment you made above:

"It seems far more logical to me that he [Lee Oswald] would have disposed of the rifle after shooting at General Walker (if that's what he did) and before his trip to New Orleans."

I have myself often wondered why Oswald did not get rid of the C2766 Carcano rifle after he tried to kill General Walker with it on April 10, 1963. Here are two times in the past I wrote about that mystery—in 2009 and 2016:


"Oswald could be pretty brazen at times. For example—holding on to the rifle with which he shot at General Walker. Oswald, incredibly, apparently actually felt no need or desire to get rid of the weapon with which he took that potshot at Walker.

For more than SEVEN MONTHS he held onto it, even though he almost certainly had to know that the bullet that he fired into Walker's house WAS recovered and could conceivably (for all Oswald knew) be linked to Carcano Rifle #C2766.

I've often wondered why in the world Oswald didn't toss Rifle C2766 in the trash after he shot at Walker on April 10, 1963 (or dispose of it in some other fashion). He ran a fearful risk by keeping that rifle in his possession for all those months.

Perhaps it was a sign of Oswald's miserly and penny-pinching ways. Maybe he just hated the idea of spending $21.45 for a weapon he would only be using once.

I also wonder this --- Would Oswald have disposed of his rifle if he had succeeded in killing General Edwin A. Walker in April 1963?

And I also sometimes wonder this --- If Oswald HAD trashed his Carcano rifle after the Walker shooting, would he have purchased another rifle at some point in time to use in another assassination attempt?

It's possible, of course, that even if Oswald had disposed of the C2766 Carcano, he could have still purchased another gun to use on President Kennedy. Oswald had enough time to get himself another gun between the time he could have learned for certain that JFK would be passing by the front door of the Depository and November 22 itself.

Which begs the follow-up question (which has been asked by many people too) --- Since Oswald had more than $170 and since he had at least 2 to 3 days to get himself another gun...why did LHO decide to use his traceable mail-order Mannlicher-Carcano rifle to shoot the President?

Food for thought anyway.

In summary:

We can never know the answers to all these questions relating to Lee Harvey Oswald, his rifle, and the thoughts that might have been floating around in his warped brain. But the one thing that we do know beyond all REASONABLE DOUBT is this --- Lee Oswald took Mannlicher-Carcano rifle #C2766 to work with him on 11/22/63 and fired three shots from that weapon at President Kennedy from the sixth floor of the Book Depository Building."
-- DVP; June 28, 2009

----------------------------

"Lee Oswald purchases a cheap rifle for himself in March 1963 (so he can shoot a certain retired general in Dallas). He misses in his attempt to kill General Walker, but decides to hang on to the Carcano rifle (for some reason that I've never quite been able to figure out, other than his own extreme stinginess and unwillingness to get rid of something he only used once)." -- DVP; March 6, 2016
« Last Edit: June 11, 2022, 04:22:07 AM by David Von Pein »