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 October 18, 2011, 05:41:37 PM
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Super Member
Posts: 6715
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I am proposing a new project which will need several people to complete. I believe that Rosemary Willis is the Rosetta Stone to the timing. We can see her running past the top of the reflecting pool in the Dorman film and then the Martin film. The last time we can see her is just before the first time we see her in the Zapruder film. If we can accurately track her running, plot Cartesians coordinates at each frame and then calculate her speed we have an accurate clock. I believe it is even possible that the last frame of the Dorman film might overlap with frame 133 of the Zapruder film. Then we could calculate how the Dorman film syncs with the Zapruder film. I think that when we see McLain's cycle in the Dorman film that frame matches a time in the Zapruder film after Z-133. What I would like to see created is a type of stroboscopic panel of frames from all the films, Dorman, Martin, and Zapruder much like the old Muybridge photos. But with digital technology we could do even more. Here is an example of a modern technique: As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
Register or Login Ideally the images can be overlaid onto a map and above the whole panel can be reference lines describing each frame and how much space there is between her position at each frame and what her speed was. To start we might want to use every fourth frame. The exact distance between two frames is not as important as the average speed over a few frames. Once we know if her speed was constant or increasing or decreasing we can project that to her first position at Z-133. I hope that Martin will donate his map to the project, at least the area at the top of the reflecting pool. It may seem like a hassle, but I would prefer that all measurements be done in feet and speeds in fps. Cartesian Coordinates are based on the origin being the intersection of the middle of Main Street with the middle of Houston Street. The X coordinate runs up Houston Street and the Y coordinate runs up Main Street. So an example of Cartesian coordinates for Rosemary's position would be something like (205,43). If anyone can start by making a mockup in Photoshop to illustrate what I want to see that will help to clarify what it should look like. I don't have the software to do it myself.
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« Last Edit: October 18, 2011, 05:50:25 PM by Anthony Marsh »
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October 18, 2011, 09:05:14 PM
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Sr. Member
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wow, good idea, i think it can be done. I 'll use my 3d scene to check that. It would nbe useful ti have rosemary stabilised maybe with adobe premiere, is it possible to have good frames of doorman rosemary ? Here is a first pic of my new version of the Dealey Plaza remote observatory. I have focused on the pergola zone but i can go back far beyond frame 133 and track Rosemary as i did for toni foster. Next step could be to place the whole motorcade. My Goal is to get something like Star *Trek Enterprise's Holodeck with Dealey Plaza. here is a top view of my provisoire Rosemary Path, one of my source is Don roberdeau"s Map, (never noticed errors more than one or two pixels on it) As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
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« Last Edit: October 18, 2011, 09:15:04 PM by Thierry Speth »
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October 18, 2011, 10:43:17 PM
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Super Member
Posts: 6715
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wow, good idea, i think it can be done. I 'll use my 3d scene to check that. It would nbe useful ti have rosemary stabilised maybe with adobe premiere, is it possible to have good frames of doorman rosemary ? Here is a first pic of my new version of the Dealey Plaza remote observatory. I have focused on the pergola zone but i can go back far beyond frame 133 and track Rosemary as i did for toni foster. Next step could be to place the whole motorcade. My Goal is to get something like Star *Trek Enterprise's Holodeck with Dealey Plaza. here is a top view of my provisoire Rosemary Path, one of my source is Don roberdeau"s Map, (never noticed errors more than one or two pixels on it) As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
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Register or LoginSeveral people have posted several excellent Dorman frames. That's why I think it has to be a group effort. On your map are you able to easily change it from blueprint to black on white survey? I looked at a couple of the frames you posted and noticed a couple of problems. The limo looks strange. I think you have both windows up and too wide. John Connally's window was down and Nellie's was only open halfway. Does your program allow you to add grid lines as ghosts?
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« Last Edit: October 20, 2011, 09:06:58 PM by Anthony Marsh »
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October 18, 2011, 11:28:47 PM
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Super Member
Posts: 2355
Germany
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I could offer Rose Willis in Z, stable 91 frames, 5.6 MB GIF
and in Dorman, stable 92 frames, 4.3 MB GIF
If that would help let me know and I'll post them.
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"ich bin ein Berliner" As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
Register or Login"There's none so blind as those who will not see."
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October 19, 2011, 07:50:06 AM
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Oh yes it is strange, because the limo is not finished, the windows positions are not accurate, no wheels etc... To make a good alignement, i need to use two versions of the limo, -one without wheels to check angle of the sun on chrome and metal (the one you saw) - and the other only with wheels and the seats (to fit with orville and aby). It is necessary for making a good alignement, and morover, nix movie has begun between two zapruder frames. Yes it is possible to have a BW background, i have all blueprints in the scene, but on this screenshot, i have transformed don roberdeau's map in a 3d object to see collisions between my 3d model and his map. Grid lines can be added. I didn't use meters or feets as scale, but a scale with allows me to put precisely objects with two digits after coma. To contribute to your projects, i will have to generate maybe a top view in 3d and rescale the result on a perfect scaled model with feets as you suggest. For this work, it would be necessary to identify the whole motorcade composition, i have the description on text but i don't know who was in the cars, except for some witnesses. There is a lot of work to do to place all objects, it can be done. Z138 show how a lot of cars are located and this fits with doorman movie. Does anybody know in which window doorman was filming? When placing the humans, i need to name them (sometime i invent some name like on the croft picture) and place them precisely. Do anybody know where this fantastic picture come from ? Any better view? All witnesses seem to be indentified on it : As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
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« Last Edit: October 19, 2011, 08:20:08 AM by Thierry Speth »
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October 19, 2011, 10:38:48 AM
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Dorman frames: As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
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« Last Edit: October 19, 2011, 10:42:43 AM by Robin Unger »
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October 19, 2011, 11:29:27 AM
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Germany
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Zapruder, Frames 133 - 223, Focus on Rosermary Willis, 5.5 MB slowed down 50%, downsized 50% (GIF animation below)    or try this url: As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
Register or LoginDorman, stabilized, slowed down 50% (8.25fps), 4.2MB (Gif animation below)  url: As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
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« Last Edit: October 20, 2011, 12:17:05 PM by Gerda Dunckel »
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October 19, 2011, 11:38:41 AM
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Original thread. " Rosemary Willis running in Dorman " As a guest, you are not allowed to view links.
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