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 January 30, 2009, 01:50:11 AM
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I have my problems to believe the SBT (entrance wound in the back and exit wound in the throat of JFK)
and til now i was, to admit, unsure to locate a shooting position which allows a clean LOS to the throat of Kennedy.
I found some interesting theories on several discussion boards .
As you probably know i'am an experienced 3D Freelancer.
My work of the 3D Plaza growth more and more.
Now in progress, i've learned there was a LOS from the northern stockade fence (Elm Street).
In the time period from Z201-Z225 an alleged front shooter may had really a chance to capture that throat shot.
I've attached the Willis photograph (Z#202) and a crop of a Survey map with two examples (red lines)
Z201 was the first frame which allow (close before the Stemmons freeway sign) at first a Kennedy signal
from a reaction of a shot.
Later at Z#225 he lift his arms/hands towards his throat which makes a clean LOS from the front impossible.
Apart from that the "Hand waving man" came in dangerous line of fire.
Later JFK head leans too much forward and also his hands remain too long in this upward position.
This is just a theory.
I've read also that such a shot might come through the windshield to Kennedy.
When i follow that trajectory i see it might have to come from the southern stockade fence (Commerce Street).
This theory let room for some doubts because the windshield damage looks like an inside lesions.
Anyway, it is possible.
Another theory came from Wim Dankbaars Forum. From Wim himself: This is an exit wound from a fragment of an explosive bullet that hit in the head.
You know Wim stands in for the theory James Files was the grassy knoll shooter.
It would be interesting to know what you think about all theories.
Thank you forward.
Edit: The white rectangle to BDM can be ignored. It's not from me.
Martin
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« Last Edit: January 30, 2009, 02:07:32 AM by Martin Hinrichs »
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February 06, 2009, 10:37:08 PM
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Super Member
Posts: 2660
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note how i stayed away from the magic bullet! Oops, sorry John.
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 Ian Lloyd |
February 06, 2009, 11:47:53 PM
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i DON'T belive in magic, but it seems to me Jack and Connally react instantly to a shot as they emerge from the sign in the Zapruder film. Thanks for your opinion John. Yes, both men reacting simultaneous. But...that does not mean both men are hit by the same bullet. The trajectory from the 6 floor window to the back of Kennedy to the throat of him is impossible. I've did a 3D test with a 3D human figure and the angle won't fit at all. The shot have to come a lower position to meet both wounds. If....then DalTex 2-3 floor. But if that happens (bullet through Kennedys body) this bullet cannot hit Conally's backwound. The only solution i have is, both men are hit by seperate bullets. Martin I'll agree with you there Martin - just because both men react simultaneously doesn't mean that they were both struck by the same bullet, though that in itself gives rise to other conundrums. As I've said previously, I have, in the past, considered a choreographed shooting scenario whereby two shots were fired simultaneously, each hitting JFK & Connally in their backs (note how the angle of the wound just in JFK's back changes through the various examinations etc. from 45-60 degrees at the autopsy (Siebert & O'Neill if I recall correctly), to 45 degrees intitially in the WC hearings then, finally to something like 21 degress). Obviously, this gives rise to many more questions such as the positioning of the 2 shooters and; was Connally targeted as well as JFK? I've certainly not discounted this theory yet...
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Ian Lloyd |
February 13, 2009, 03:06:34 PM
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Nice work again Martin!!!
I thought exactly the same thing when I watched it and, unfortunately, I've seen it more than once now!!
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February 13, 2009, 05:05:34 PM
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John, I was with you on your first post in this thread, but you lost me with your second post LOL
I could not agree more with Dale Myers, Single Bullet Fact. Dale Myers is a good American.
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« Last Edit: February 15, 2010, 06:45:44 AM by Bill Brown »
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"The TRUTH doesn't require anyone's belief." - Dale Myers
"The human mind craves a mystery more than it loves the truth." - Dan Rather
"Reason does not always appeal to unreasonable men." - John F. Kennedy
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February 13, 2009, 05:18:03 PM
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John, I was with you on your first post in this thread, but you lost me with your second post LOL
I could not agree more with Dale Meyers, Single Bullet Fact. Dale Meyers is a good American.
......Ooookaaay. I understand. Thanks Bill Martin
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February 13, 2009, 05:39:18 PM
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thanks for the information about the SBT, which is impossible. So, the Discovery Channel faked the results of their own simulation by omitting the necessary exit wound of the bullet!
David Wrone in the book the Zapuder film says that Kennedy and Connally were shot at different times. Kennedy is shot and reacting to a wound as early as Z205, which is before the time that Oswald could have fired. (According to the FBI and the Warren commission, Oswald did not have a clear shot of Kennedy prior to Z210, because the tree was blocking his view.)
Connally claimed that he was hit by a 2nd bullet, not the first.
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February 13, 2009, 06:57:30 PM
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what is the source for the 3 minute video showing why the Discovery channel isn't telling the whole story?
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February 13, 2009, 07:11:20 PM
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Thanks for your comment David. what is the source for the 3 minute video showing why the Discovery channel isn't telling the whole story?
I don't know about that video. If you find it, can you please post a link? Thank you Thank you Ian. Good to know others see it the same way. dance; Martin
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February 16, 2009, 06:20:53 PM
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Posts: 41
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I have my problems to believe the SBT (entrance wound in the back and exit wound in the throat of JFK)
and til now i was, to admit, unsure to locate a shooting position which allows a clean LOS to the throat of Kennedy.
I found some interesting theories on several discussion boards .
As you probably know i'am an experienced 3D Freelancer.
My work of the 3D Plaza growth more and more.
Now in progress, i've learned there was a LOS from the northern stockade fence (Elm Street).
In the time period from Z201-Z225 an alleged front shooter may had really a chance to capture that throat shot.
I've attached the Willis photograph (Z#202) and a crop of a Survey map with two examples (red lines)
Z201 was the first frame which allow (close before the Stemmons freeway sign) at first a Kennedy signal
from a reaction of a shot.
Later at Z#225 he lift his arms/hands towards his throat which makes a clean LOS from the front impossible.
Apart from that the "Hand waving man" came in dangerous line of fire.
Later JFK head leans too much forward and also his hands remain too long in this upward position.
This is just a theory.
I've read also that such a shot might come through the windshield to Kennedy.
When i follow that trajectory i see it might have to come from the southern stockade fence (Commerce Street).
This theory let room for some doubts because the windshield damage looks like an inside lesions.
Anyway, it is possible.
Another theory came from Wim Dankbaars Forum. From Wim himself: This is an exit wound from a fragment of an explosive bullet that hit in the head.
You know Wim stands in for the theory James Files was the grassy knoll shooter.
It would be interesting to know what you think about all theories.
Thank you forward.
Edit: The white rectangle to BDM can be ignored. It's not from me.
Martin
Martin, your trajectory analysis about the possible shot from the fence, confirms once more to me that JFK was hit to the throat by a bullet fired around to Z200 (Willis 5 photograph shot). I think, moreover, that 1.5 second later (Z227-Z228) JFK was hit to the back when he was still reacting to the throat wound with raised arms. Just the arms raised in that way could cause such a curvature to the jacket shoulders to explain why the hole of the back wound does not correspond to the holes in the clothes, and just the violent impact of the bullet could cause the fast and evident push forward of Kennedy trunk. Here the shot to the throat  And here the shot to the back   Regards Giuseppe
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« Last Edit: February 16, 2009, 06:24:44 PM by Giuseppe Sabatino »
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February 16, 2009, 08:35:08 PM
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Hmmmm......you wanna talk magic bullets? If there was a shooter behind that fence, he had NO SHOT whatsoever at Kennedy to cause the throat wound. Because of the white concrete retaining wall he couldn't even see the President on Elm St. but for a split second, not long enough to even get Kennedy in his sights. That bullet would have had to shoot straight out from the fence, over the wall, but then curve downward to hit the President. In the Willis crop that Martin posted you can see the location of the "shooter" behind the fence, and you can see Kennedy. But that does not mean that the "shooter" could see Kennedy. If Willis was sitting there beside Kennedy and snapped the picture along the exact same line as his actual photo, the fence wouldn't even show up in the photo, it would be hidden behind the white retaining wall. You'd only be able to see the top of the trees that were next to the fence and the clear blue sky. That Willis photo does not give one the appreciation for how much below the line of sight Kennedy would have been to a shooter behind the fence to cause the throat wound.
If you don't believe me, and if you have the time, feel free to hunt down land surveys of the grounds and you'd see for yourself. As for me, I don't have to, I've been there in person and looked at the exact thing that I am talking about. I've stood behind that fence and looked at all of the possibilities with an open mind. A shooter behind that fence can't even see a car on Elm Street until that car passes in front of him, once it has passed the end of the white retaining wall. Not to mention the huge Stemmons Freeway sign that was in place that day.
Unrelated: A shooter behind that fence in that location couldn't follow the President in his sights because of the white retaining wall for long enough to even have fired the fatal head shot. He would have had to fire the shot in the split second that Kennedy came into his sights once Kennedy came into view after reaching/passing the end of the wall.
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